A quick search of Amish recipes shows they do use seed oils, at least to some non-trivial extent. And they eat enormous amounts of high glycemic index foods - sugar (even in their bread) and lots and lots of wheat, potatoes and corn.
However I don't think they eat much "processed" food - they themselves prepare everything they eat.
> And they eat enormous amounts of high glycemic index foods - sugar (even in their bread) and lots and lots of wheat, potatoes and corn.
Sure, but so did vast numbers of people throughout the world for all of recorded history. Sucrose might be an exception, but it becomes glucose and fructose very quickly in the body.
Calories are *necessary* for obesity, but if they're the *cause* something odd is going on.
Hell, in my athletic days I ate enormous quantities of pasta and potatoes. I thought nothing of cooking an entire pan of spaghetti and eating the lot in one sitting, drowned in salt and butter. Never shifted my weight by any noticeable amount.
> A quick search of Amish recipes shows they do use seed oils
Yes, I'm wondering if actually they're mostly just eating the same stuff as everyone else. (Hence the buggy outside McDonalds photo.) But it sounds like different groups make different compromises with modernity, so I wonder if maybe there are some communities somewhere that only eat what they grow.
Just so. If we could show that any particular group of Amish don't eat seed oils, or even much seed oil, and yet they have the same 'diseases of modernity' as everyone else, then I'd abandon 'PUFAs bad' on the spot.
On the other hand, if we can find an Amish community that never touches the things and they're totally fine like the Kitavans apparently were, then that's an argument that whatever the problem is, it's something those guys are avoiding somehow.
If we can find an Amish community that has some of the diseases but not others, then that would show that there's more than one thing going on.
That's why I suddenly care about Amish health. Paradoxes mean that something you know is wrong.
I'm not trying to defend a political position here. I'm trying to find out what is true.
I wonder if there are any more 'modernity refuseniks' in the West? The nice thing about religious lunatics is that they're not a self-selected sample.
Pah, the God *I* don't believe in wouldn't accept pretend faith. He's better than that.
I'm happy to accept a small chance of burning for all eternity as an honest atheist. I'm not prepared to burn for all eternity as a consequence of trying to deceive a god. I'd feel I deserved it.
Saw your post on r/SaturatedFat and think the following comment is worth highlighting:
"Yeah, I saw a documentary on the Amish and I was struck by their appalling dental health ..."
If your teeth aren't clean and properly cared for then you aren't going to be healthy. And lack of dental care (plus the enormous amount of sweets and carbs that are so destructive to teeth which the Amish eat) might explain (along with PUFAs) the otherwise surprising rate of disease among the Amish.
A quick search of Amish recipes shows they do use seed oils, at least to some non-trivial extent. And they eat enormous amounts of high glycemic index foods - sugar (even in their bread) and lots and lots of wheat, potatoes and corn.
However I don't think they eat much "processed" food - they themselves prepare everything they eat.
> And they eat enormous amounts of high glycemic index foods - sugar (even in their bread) and lots and lots of wheat, potatoes and corn.
Sure, but so did vast numbers of people throughout the world for all of recorded history. Sucrose might be an exception, but it becomes glucose and fructose very quickly in the body.
Calories are *necessary* for obesity, but if they're the *cause* something odd is going on.
Hell, in my athletic days I ate enormous quantities of pasta and potatoes. I thought nothing of cooking an entire pan of spaghetti and eating the lot in one sitting, drowned in salt and butter. Never shifted my weight by any noticeable amount.
> A quick search of Amish recipes shows they do use seed oils
Yes, I'm wondering if actually they're mostly just eating the same stuff as everyone else. (Hence the buggy outside McDonalds photo.) But it sounds like different groups make different compromises with modernity, so I wonder if maybe there are some communities somewhere that only eat what they grow.
Would have to get adipose tissue biopsy to find out long term consumption I guess :(
I wouldn't change my mind substantially short of this. Or, maybe, really really good OmegaQuant/food recall data.
Just so. If we could show that any particular group of Amish don't eat seed oils, or even much seed oil, and yet they have the same 'diseases of modernity' as everyone else, then I'd abandon 'PUFAs bad' on the spot.
On the other hand, if we can find an Amish community that never touches the things and they're totally fine like the Kitavans apparently were, then that's an argument that whatever the problem is, it's something those guys are avoiding somehow.
If we can find an Amish community that has some of the diseases but not others, then that would show that there's more than one thing going on.
That's why I suddenly care about Amish health. Paradoxes mean that something you know is wrong.
I'm not trying to defend a political position here. I'm trying to find out what is true.
I wonder if there are any more 'modernity refuseniks' in the West? The nice thing about religious lunatics is that they're not a self-selected sample.
That's what I've heard from Brad Marshall, who has apparently lots of contact with Amish, being in the food production business in upstate New York.
He said they "love" seed oils cause they're so cheap.
Everyone loves seed oilz! Perhaps they are right! Perhaps the problem is something else?
heh. obvious comment: you DO need to. . .
Pah, the God *I* don't believe in wouldn't accept pretend faith. He's better than that.
I'm happy to accept a small chance of burning for all eternity as an honest atheist. I'm not prepared to burn for all eternity as a consequence of trying to deceive a god. I'd feel I deserved it.
Saw your post on r/SaturatedFat and think the following comment is worth highlighting:
"Yeah, I saw a documentary on the Amish and I was struck by their appalling dental health ..."
If your teeth aren't clean and properly cared for then you aren't going to be healthy. And lack of dental care (plus the enormous amount of sweets and carbs that are so destructive to teeth which the Amish eat) might explain (along with PUFAs) the otherwise surprising rate of disease among the Amish.